Gavin Richards and Cali Jantzen, summer 2023 interns
Gavin Richards and Cali Jantzen spent the summer at New England Review producing two episodes of the NER Out Loud podcast, to be released in August and November. They also designed a new display for Davis Library, created posts for our website, read submissions, and helped out wherever needed. Here they interview each other for our “Meet the Interns” series.
Gavin: 11:14 AM. Middlebury, Vermont. We are at the swing-set [across from the NER office]. What do you have to say about that, Cali?
Cali: Um, it’s Monday. [Laughing] We just had our photo taken on the swing-set, so I think that pretty much sums it up.
G: We are currently above four large puddles despite it being extremely sunny outside, which about sums up this summer’s weather. It’s a nice day, but it feels a bit weird considering there’s been about four of them all summer. So, let’s get into it . . . Okay, Cali, you’re trapped on an island for eternity, and you can only bring five books with you. Which are they?
C: The first that came to mind—that I haven’t read since I was maybe eleven years old—is Stargirl by Jerry Spinelli. Then Giovanni’s Room by James Baldwin. I think that’s my favorite book of all time. Hmm . . . [long pause] . . . let me think of my next ones. What are you thinking? Not just top five. It’s the ones you want forever.
G: Right, right. I’d have to go number one: The Catcher in the Rye. GOAT book. Number two would have to be . . . [laughs] . . . this is proving harder than I thought it would be. Number two would be . . . Dubliners by James Joyce. Number three would be . . . [long pause] . . . you can keep chimin’ in whenever you have a . . .
C: Okay, I thought about one. All About Love by bell hooks. I could go door-to-door selling that book. I’m obsessed with it.
G: Three for me would be A Confederacy of Dunces by John Kennedy Toole.
C: Okay, another teenage boy book, but I’d have to say The Stranger by Camus. I love Camus.
G: I’d have to go to my young adult fiction roots for number four. Going back to the GOAT of ALL time, John Green’s Looking for Alaska.
C: Oh yeah!
G: I don’t think I could get tired of that book. [Laughing; long pause] Um . . . one more.
G: [Joking] Well, actually, I guess we’re bringing four for eternity.
C: Let’s keep thinking about four. But I had a good question: what was the first “chapter book” you read?
G: Oh . . . you go first.
C: Well, mine . . . this was when I became an English major, I think. It was in first grade, everyone was reading Diary of a Wimpy Kid, and I felt so left out that I wasn’t at that reading level yet, that I couldn’t comprehend it. And what I would tell everyone was “It’s just the font. The font—” ‘Cause it had this handwriting font. I told everyone, “Oh, I just can’t get past the font. It’s too much for me.” And I went crazy—like teaching myself how to get to that level. And that was my . . .
G: So, I guess you became an English major in the first grade.
C: Because of Diary of a Wimpy Kid, yes. That’s exactly how it happened.
G: [Joking] So you’re saying you’re an English major because of some inferiority complex at six years old?
C: I think that’s how anyone becomes an English major. [Laughing]
C: How did you become an English major?
G: Huh. That’s actually a good question. I—well, I applied to Middlebury thinking I would do Math and Philosophy, thinking I would be some kind of logic-whiz, which—
C: [Joking] You’d be Will Hunting.
G: [Laughing] So extremely emotionally stunted—
C: [Joking] That’s going to be you!
G: Yeah, sure, we’ll go with that. I came in as a Feb after a semester off and thought I should shake up my life a bit. I think that’s what it came down to. I’d taken AP World Lit during senior year and we’d read some really good books. I’d never been particularly interested in reading until about September or October [of 2020] when we read Brave New World by Aldous Huxley. I’ll never forget the ending of it, and how it struck me. When my Febmester started, I decided to read regularly. I chose a couple of books from high school to get back into reading, including The Catcher in the Rye, which years earlier I thought was just okay but later realized was incredible. I think it was a matter of perspective, really, and how being older allowed me to reflect on myself through the character of Holden. And then I reread Slaughterhouse-Five, which was also great. Reading two great books was all I needed to keep me going, and I got really interested in what it means to be a writer. I started writing because I had the time, and my work was terrible. Well, 95 percent of what I wrote was terrible. I’ve been going at it for about a year now.
C: [Joking; an allusion to Slaughterhouse-Five] So it goes.
G: [Continuing the joke] Who died? [pause] How did you become an English major?
C: It’s funny. I was very reluctant to become an English major ‘cause it had this kind of—my friends would jokingly call me an English major because of other things I did. I was told I dressed like an English major, spoke like an English major, did X, Y, and Z like an English major, so at a certain point it became like this derogatory term. So I came into Middlebury thinking I’d just study Political Science but, lo and behold, took some English courses and really loved them. I took two courses with Yumna Siddiqi, and it was this perfect blend of political theory and literature, and from there I completely delved into the English department and its offerings. Now I think I might like my English major more than my Political Science major! [pause] Well, you’re a double major, too?
G: I am. English and Philosophy. I’ve taken a few courses in English that were extremely inspiring. It feels as though I’ve learned more in an isolated period of time, ten or twelve weeks. And that has been really cool—to see yourself improve in real time. Philosophy is a smaller department. There are only about nine majors each year, so you get a lot of focus and attention, but there are fewer faculty. My grief with the department is that they only offer—well, they really focus on analytical philosophy instead of continental philosophy, so there’s less room to look at philosophy through ideology and history than logic-based systems. That was a poor description, but it’s true. I took a class last spring called Philosophy of Language—that was really cool. I’m taking Buddhist Philosophy in the fall, and I’m really excited for that. It’s with the same prof. There are a lot of courses that are great and I’m really grateful for that. I think the two subjects work very well together. [pause] Okay, wait, you’re still trapped on the island for eternity, and you’ve lost all your books.
C: Ugh!
G: Tough, I know. But you just found a DVD player buried in the sand, and somehow there’s also an outlet.
C: And a projector of course.
G: Which five movies are you bringing?
C: This is like the letterbox’d top four.
G: Plus one!
C: Okay. One: Her—just because that has a special place in my heart. I feel like as I grow that movie kind of sticks with me. I just love it. Also, E.T., which you’ll have qualms with, but I could watch it over and over again. It’s just so magical. I feel like a kid watching it. And I kind of love E.T. . . . I think he would be great in the NER office.
G: Maybe he’d turn on us at one point.
C: No!
G: [Joking] And we’d all be decimated.
C: No, he’d be very helpful. [pause] Okay, now you do two.
G: Wow, that’s hard. Okay, Annie Hall—
C: Oh, yes, yes, yes!
G: I could watch that forever. Okay, Annie Hall for both of us. [Long pause] The Last Picture Show by Peter Bogdanovich.
C: Oh, I never did end up watching that this summer.
G: I could watch that forever. Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, probably. I could watch 12 Angry Men forever.
C: Really?
G: That last spot, you know, I’d have to do something happier. Oh, The Big Lebowski! I need something I can laugh at. But, you know, I have to give shout-outs to Chinatown by Roman Polanski, My Own Private Idaho by Gus Van Sant, Before Sunset by Richard Linklater, Ikiru by Akira Kurosawa, The End of the Tour by James Ponsoldt, and Playtime by Jacques Tati—
C: [Joking] So all the movies ever—
G: —and Y Tu Mama También by Alfonso Cuoran.
C: Okay, I thought of a movie that will make me laugh—Best in Show by Christopher Guest. I think I rewatched it two times this summer, and I think that’s a movie that works for any situation, any audience. It never gets old. It’s so supremely well-written. It’s so funny. [long pause] Oh, this is hard.
G: It’s okay. You can bring three or four movies.
C: I’m just thinking. I could bring The Graduate by Mike Nichols. I love Eyes Wide Shut by Stanley Kubrick. I don’t know if I would be rewatching that a lot—
G: You could make that your once-a-week movie, while the others are all day.
C: Right, right. Oh, but I feel like I need a sweet, comfort movie.
G: Yeah, like When Harry Met Sally. That would be a good one.
C: I don’t like that movie.
G: What?!
C: I didn’t like it.
G: That hurts.
C: Uh-oh.
G: That was a spike to my heart.
C: [Laughing] Don’t publish that.
G: It’s going in! Any future person reading this transcription: I hope you agree with me that When Harry Met Sally is heartwarming and meaningful.
C: I’m more of a Sleepless in Seattle girl.
G: Okay, Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan at the top of the Empire State Building?
C: Oh, yeah.
G: Okay, favorite aspect of working at NER?
C: I like just being in the office—the spontaneous conversations that we have, whether it’s over a submission or interviews we did, or a headline we saw that morning. I think we had a lot of thought-provoking and silly conversations that you wouldn’t expect.
G: I agree. Favorite aspect for me would be . . . probably the same thing.
C: Now you’re stealing mine!
G: I know [laughing]. My favorite aspect would be the small moments when you’d be working on something, and you’re able to discuss it passionately with people around you.
C: Or finding Nosferatu on the Believer poster. [Laughing]
G: That’s an easter-egg for any future NER interns. Find Nosferatu in the office, then you’ll know what’s up.
C: Wrestling with the printer, too.
G: Agreed. What surprised you the most about working at NER?
C: I guess learning about the publishing industry more broadly. I think we had a lot of candid conversations with Carolyn and Leslie about what it’s like to be a published author and what that process is like. And I think it was, on one hand, a little nerve-wracking to hear about how lengthy and difficult the process can be. But, you know, on other hand, it was pretty inspiring and invigorating. I felt excited to jump in and engage with that.
G: What surprised me most about NER was how long it takes to go from accepted submission to publication. That was sort of shocking to me. That’s what I learned, and that’s what scares me. [Laughing] Never give up! Writing for the sake of writing, not clout! [pause] Okay, last question: what are you reading next?
C: Well, I just started reading Cool Capitalism. But I think my next actual book will be Nausea by Sartre.
G: Me too!
C: Really!?
G: Yeah!